Heated meeting to discuss £500,000 council retail payment

THE granting of an extra half a million pounds to Hereford's controversial retail and leisure complex has been at the centre of a heated debate this morning.

Members of Herefordshire Council's Overview and Scrutiny Committee discussed the reasons behind cabinet's recent approval of £500,000 towards Old Market developer Stanhope.

The funding shortfall has come about after the scheme's funding partner British Land said market conditions mean it needs to see a change in the financial return it gets from the complex.

Changes to the funding deal means Stanhope expects to receive around £3m less from British Land, meaning they have asked the council to contribute the £500,000 towards the shortfall.

Five recommendations were agreed by Scrutiny during the meeting at the council's Brockington HQ.

They include asking Cabinet, when it meets to discuss the matter on Monday, what steps have been taken to safeguard the council's position under European Procurement laws and ensuring risks are segregated between those that apply to Stanhope and the council.

Scrutiny also wants Cabinet to prove value for money by showing further due diligence and ensure the reasons behind commercial confidentiality are carefully considered. 

 

Comments (62)

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1:27pm Fri 9 Nov 12

fordshire77 says...

VALUE FOR MONEY!
I CAN SAVE THEM A STACK OF CASH.......STARTING WITH THE SACKING JARVIS!!
VALUE FOR MONEY! I CAN SAVE THEM A STACK OF CASH.......STARTING WITH THE SACKING JARVIS!! fordshire77
  • Score: 0

1:53pm Fri 9 Nov 12

fmrbill says...

well 2 points here from where Im looking 1) Im sure we would all like to be able to go our suppliers etc and use the excuse oh by the way the market conditions have changed I want more money after you, once and agreement has been signed and sealed, or PERHAPS it wasnt signed and sealed as we were told ???. 2) I like the letter in the Hereford times from a concerned member of the public who states let it be a HUGE car park and a PLEASANT looking bridge directly across the road towards the city centre and then build MORE low cost housing for LOCAL PEOPLE on all the car parks around the city centre like Bath Street, and other smaller surrouding ones. How does that sound of have I missed an obvious reason why that cant happen. So in 3 ways we solve problems a car park which doesnt flood,more parking closer to city centre and more low costing housing to solve the issue there. What are the views of other bloggers please guys
well 2 points here from where Im looking 1) Im sure we would all like to be able to go our suppliers etc and use the excuse oh by the way the market conditions have changed I want more money after you, once and agreement has been signed and sealed, or PERHAPS it wasnt signed and sealed as we were told ???. 2) I like the letter in the Hereford times from a concerned member of the public who states let it be a HUGE car park and a PLEASANT looking bridge directly across the road towards the city centre and then build MORE low cost housing for LOCAL PEOPLE on all the car parks around the city centre like Bath Street, and other smaller surrouding ones. How does that sound of have I missed an obvious reason why that cant happen. So in 3 ways we solve problems a car park which doesnt flood,more parking closer to city centre and more low costing housing to solve the issue there. What are the views of other bloggers please guys fmrbill
  • Score: 0

2:00pm Fri 9 Nov 12

Biomech says...

+1 for sacking Jarvis
+1 for sacking Jarvis Biomech
  • Score: 0

2:53pm Fri 9 Nov 12

shunter50 says...

When the scrutiny commitee sanction everything "which they will" because this council are in such a mess and cannot afford to back out because of the millions already invested in the project I worry what public services will be cut to make up the shortfall. And as for Hereford Futures Hereford does not have a future under this council I say sack the lot of them before its too late
When the scrutiny commitee sanction everything "which they will" because this council are in such a mess and cannot afford to back out because of the millions already invested in the project I worry what public services will be cut to make up the shortfall. And as for Hereford Futures Hereford does not have a future under this council I say sack the lot of them before its too late shunter50
  • Score: 0

3:11pm Fri 9 Nov 12

Lukio says...

Looks like the Scrutiny Committee are staring to do what they're supposed to do it with a majority of Tories on Cabinet I don't expect miracles.

I hope they at least realise that they need to be more accountable and transparent. I eagerly await the outcome of the meeting on Monday.

In response to fmrbill, I agree low cost housing is required and parking is a sensible suggestion but currently there is little reason for people to visit hereford anyway so we essentially could end up with an empty car park. We need redevelopment desperately but the way HC have approached this and are continuing to handle this is nothing short of atrocious and, with this bung to Stanhope, could actually be illegal. As Colin pointed out on another post, we need real alternatives and as far as I understand there is no Plan B and they're so far into this they can't back out.

Oh and another +1 for Jarvis out ;)
Looks like the Scrutiny Committee are staring to do what they're supposed to do it with a majority of Tories on Cabinet I don't expect miracles. I hope they at least realise that they need to be more accountable and transparent. I eagerly await the outcome of the meeting on Monday. In response to fmrbill, I agree low cost housing is required and parking is a sensible suggestion but currently there is little reason for people to visit hereford anyway so we essentially could end up with an empty car park. We need redevelopment desperately but the way HC have approached this and are continuing to handle this is nothing short of atrocious and, with this bung to Stanhope, could actually be illegal. As Colin pointed out on another post, we need real alternatives and as far as I understand there is no Plan B and they're so far into this they can't back out. Oh and another +1 for Jarvis out ;) Lukio
  • Score: 0

3:18pm Fri 9 Nov 12

fmrbill says...

Not just JARVIS a few others and a recall of some public pensions who have been paid by us like chief Ex who have allowed all this to go on as well.
Just another point that interesting article in the HT about the Local Parish Council and FOI request being refused. Anyone thought about requesting the minutes of the meeting for all the secretive meeting regarding new excutitives and this development, let HC refuse and then let the FOI Commissioner decide. I bet minutes have even been kept. Any one got the time or inclination to take this on. WHAT ABOUT KING BOBBY47 the leader of a new army !!!!!
Not just JARVIS a few others and a recall of some public pensions who have been paid by us like chief Ex who have allowed all this to go on as well. Just another point that interesting article in the HT about the Local Parish Council and FOI request being refused. Anyone thought about requesting the minutes of the meeting for all the secretive meeting regarding new excutitives and this development, let HC refuse and then let the FOI Commissioner decide. I bet minutes have even been kept. Any one got the time or inclination to take this on. WHAT ABOUT KING BOBBY47 the leader of a new army !!!!! fmrbill
  • Score: 0

3:41pm Fri 9 Nov 12

dippyhippy says...

Just a thought,last week some of us discussed how we could bring about a vote of no confidence.It was put forward that some 7000 signatories would be required. Feelings are running so high at present,more and more people are standing up and saying enough is enough. William Rudd commented that we would struggle to get seven let alone 7000,but if the Hereford Times could start an on-line petition,I bet 7000 names would be on it quicker than you can say "sack Jarvis!" The time has come .....the peasants are revolting! Long live King Bobby!!
Just a thought,last week some of us discussed how we could bring about a vote of no confidence.It was put forward that some 7000 signatories would be required. Feelings are running so high at present,more and more people are standing up and saying enough is enough. William Rudd commented that we would struggle to get seven let alone 7000,but if the Hereford Times could start an on-line petition,I bet 7000 names would be on it quicker than you can say "sack Jarvis!" The time has come .....the peasants are revolting! Long live King Bobby!! dippyhippy
  • Score: 0

3:51pm Fri 9 Nov 12

Biomech says...

I'd sign
I'd sign Biomech
  • Score: 0

4:50pm Fri 9 Nov 12

Herefordian says...

My car is due for its annual MOT on Monday. Last year I had to have the bushes replaced in the front suspension, it's allready knocking again and I suspect they will need replacing again. This is all due to the state of this pot hole ridden city. I shall be sending a claim to Herefordsire Council should I need to have it repaired. All this because they have ignored the state of the roads in preference to wasting money in other areas. ESG....Stupid Here You Can Signs........what a load of morans
My car is due for its annual MOT on Monday. Last year I had to have the bushes replaced in the front suspension, it's allready knocking again and I suspect they will need replacing again. This is all due to the state of this pot hole ridden city. I shall be sending a claim to Herefordsire Council should I need to have it repaired. All this because they have ignored the state of the roads in preference to wasting money in other areas. ESG....Stupid Here You Can Signs........what a load of morans Herefordian
  • Score: 0

4:55pm Fri 9 Nov 12

Grid Knocker says...

@shunter50: 'Here, here': sack the useless overpaid numpteys at Hereford Futures! Twelve years in existence and what have they got to show for it? No buildings, endless pr froth and a £5-million Flood Allieviation Scheme which was clogged up by weeds the first time it rained!
@shunter50: 'Here, here': sack the useless overpaid numpteys at Hereford Futures! Twelve years in existence and what have they got to show for it? No buildings, endless pr froth and a £5-million Flood Allieviation Scheme which was clogged up by weeds the first time it rained! Grid Knocker
  • Score: 0

6:46pm Fri 9 Nov 12

Wellymitts says...

Im with you dippyhippy.We need to get the people of Hereford fired up to do something before it is too late.
Another +1 for jarvis sacking.
Im with you dippyhippy.We need to get the people of Hereford fired up to do something before it is too late. Another +1 for jarvis sacking. Wellymitts
  • Score: 0

7:21pm Fri 9 Nov 12

billyb83 says...

+1 sack jarvis and all the cabinet. Herefords a ghost town. Not being funny who wants to come to a dump like Hereford when you got alot nicer cities and towns around. Had an outsider today moaning about the cost of parking I got one in and said make most of it as its goin up on the 19th. He said last time he's visiting along with Alot more I say.
+1 sack jarvis and all the cabinet. Herefords a ghost town. Not being funny who wants to come to a dump like Hereford when you got alot nicer cities and towns around. Had an outsider today moaning about the cost of parking I got one in and said make most of it as its goin up on the 19th. He said last time he's visiting along with Alot more I say. billyb83
  • Score: 0

7:51pm Fri 9 Nov 12

littlewhitebull says...

I was talking to a group of senior citizens in our city today. They expressed some very strong feelings about the direction the council is taking. To say they were not happy bunnies would be an understatement. All of these senior citizens stressed that they thought our council was wasteful and would like to see a change of direction as soon as possible.
By the way - I came across a website today called www.hereyoucan.co.uk
Do have a look, if you have not seen it before. Our council has spent almost £22,000 on its design and management!
At a time when they are "cash-strapped" and borrowing millions, they can somehow afford the money to fund another self-serving device.
I was talking to a group of senior citizens in our city today. They expressed some very strong feelings about the direction the council is taking. To say they were not happy bunnies would be an understatement. All of these senior citizens stressed that they thought our council was wasteful and would like to see a change of direction as soon as possible. By the way - I came across a website today called www.hereyoucan.co.uk Do have a look, if you have not seen it before. Our council has spent almost £22,000 on its design and management! At a time when they are "cash-strapped" and borrowing millions, they can somehow afford the money to fund another self-serving device. littlewhitebull
  • Score: 0

8:17pm Fri 9 Nov 12

Lukio says...

Omg...not only is this going to be plastered over the road signs, it's actually a 'brand'!

Looking through the website and guidelines there's some serious work going into this...well spotted littlewhitebull.

Love the way they give examples of how you can use the 'Here you can' slogan!

Here's some of my 'Here you can' ideas:

'Here you can' bust your suspension on potholes
'Here you can' keep throwing thousands at a questionable developer
'Here you can' spend £12000 on bottled water
'Here you can' refuse local business property on the Enterprise Zone
'Here you can' have failed child protection services
'Here you can' hold as many secret meetings as you like
'Here you can' have a tantrum about people texting during a council meeting
'Here you can' hike parking charges
'Here you can' close public toilets
'Here you can' waste hours of your life sat in traffic
'Here you can' give your outgoing chief exec massive renumeration packages

Ahhh I could go on but I expect you're all getting bored of me by now ;)
Omg...not only is this going to be plastered over the road signs, it's actually a 'brand'! Looking through the website and guidelines there's some serious work going into this...well spotted littlewhitebull. Love the way they give examples of how you can use the 'Here you can' slogan! Here's some of my 'Here you can' ideas: 'Here you can' bust your suspension on potholes 'Here you can' keep throwing thousands at a questionable developer 'Here you can' spend £12000 on bottled water 'Here you can' refuse local business property on the Enterprise Zone 'Here you can' have failed child protection services 'Here you can' hold as many secret meetings as you like 'Here you can' have a tantrum about people texting during a council meeting 'Here you can' hike parking charges 'Here you can' close public toilets 'Here you can' waste hours of your life sat in traffic 'Here you can' give your outgoing chief exec massive renumeration packages Ahhh I could go on but I expect you're all getting bored of me by now ;) Lukio
  • Score: 0

8:43pm Fri 9 Nov 12

bobby47 says...

Sweet loving Jesus. There's no bloody end to this. We've gotta do something!
Sweet loving Jesus. There's no bloody end to this. We've gotta do something! bobby47
  • Score: 0

9:48pm Fri 9 Nov 12

dippyhippy says...

We really need one or two of the more decent councillors to organise an open meeting,somewhere neutral,they must realise that they need to band together,to get behind this rising tide of public opinion,and LISTEN to us! They need to be seen to be doing this ,to act in a pro-active way,show us that they can speak for this growing number. We represent an ever growing group of VOTERS! We cannot be silenced!
We really need one or two of the more decent councillors to organise an open meeting,somewhere neutral,they must realise that they need to band together,to get behind this rising tide of public opinion,and LISTEN to us! They need to be seen to be doing this ,to act in a pro-active way,show us that they can speak for this growing number. We represent an ever growing group of VOTERS! We cannot be silenced! dippyhippy
  • Score: 0

10:00pm Fri 9 Nov 12

bobby47 says...

You are on the right track my dear friend. Keep pushing this petition thing, somehow get HT to dance to our tune and get Lukio to realise that he's the leader and he's gotta just go for it and phone that Councillor.
For my part, I'll go along with anything that kicks this Coucil into the new reality that we are broke and we cant afford gimmicks and anymore mistakes.
You are on the right track my dear friend. Keep pushing this petition thing, somehow get HT to dance to our tune and get Lukio to realise that he's the leader and he's gotta just go for it and phone that Councillor. For my part, I'll go along with anything that kicks this Coucil into the new reality that we are broke and we cant afford gimmicks and anymore mistakes. bobby47
  • Score: 0

10:08pm Fri 9 Nov 12

TwoWheelsGood says...

Lukio, you realise you're in breach of the 'brand management rules' and the 51 page manual don't you - your catchy slogans must be reviewed initially by the brand guardian and if necessary by the brand management group, and finally, by King Bobby47 himself. That's at least half a dozen people on the gravy train (not b47 obviously) - pointless box ticking so we can pay them a handsome wage.

littlewhitebull - where did £22k come from - are you sure you it wasn't £220k - this amount of interactive buzz bull would certainly have cost more than £22k.
Lukio, you realise you're in breach of the 'brand management rules' and the 51 page manual don't you - your catchy slogans must be reviewed initially by the brand guardian and if necessary by the brand management group, and finally, by King Bobby47 himself. That's at least half a dozen people on the gravy train (not b47 obviously) - pointless box ticking so we can pay them a handsome wage. littlewhitebull - where did £22k come from - are you sure you it wasn't £220k - this amount of interactive buzz bull would certainly have cost more than £22k. TwoWheelsGood
  • Score: 0

10:14pm Fri 9 Nov 12

dippyhippy says...

Bobby,I have a lot of faith in Lukio,and a lot of faith that if enough of us make a noise,we will be heard.Do you know if anyone from the H.T.comes on here? I really feel that this has taken off in such a way now,they could do with following this up.I realise that they cannot show bias,but people could be given a simple choice-do they have confidence in our council or not? I also think they could print a round-up of the previous weeks posts,possibly on the letters page.This would protect anonymity,and also spread the message to a wider audience of the growing un-ease.The tide is turning!
Bobby,I have a lot of faith in Lukio,and a lot of faith that if enough of us make a noise,we will be heard.Do you know if anyone from the H.T.comes on here? I really feel that this has taken off in such a way now,they could do with following this up.I realise that they cannot show bias,but people could be given a simple choice-do they have confidence in our council or not? I also think they could print a round-up of the previous weeks posts,possibly on the letters page.This would protect anonymity,and also spread the message to a wider audience of the growing un-ease.The tide is turning! dippyhippy
  • Score: 0

10:25pm Fri 9 Nov 12

bobby47 says...

The Moderators of the HT do read these Postings and I know for a 'fact' that our views within the HT are noted.
I promise you that they do read this stuff and what we are saying is having an impact but.......
One way or the other, we all have to reach a point where we break cover, organise ourselves because HT aint going to make us the news unless we create it.
Thats the problem and I know that Lukio is reluctant to be in the limelight, so, we are where we are for the time being.
Personally speaking, my view is that 'we' have to make some contact with a Councillor who is a dead certainty to be on our side and then we have to break cover and cross our fingers that the Council dont go to war with us.
Sleep on it kiddo. Twowheels and the rest will read this exchange and Im sure we will come to a decision soon.
My warmest regards.
The Moderators of the HT do read these Postings and I know for a 'fact' that our views within the HT are noted. I promise you that they do read this stuff and what we are saying is having an impact but....... One way or the other, we all have to reach a point where we break cover, organise ourselves because HT aint going to make us the news unless we create it. Thats the problem and I know that Lukio is reluctant to be in the limelight, so, we are where we are for the time being. Personally speaking, my view is that 'we' have to make some contact with a Councillor who is a dead certainty to be on our side and then we have to break cover and cross our fingers that the Council dont go to war with us. Sleep on it kiddo. Twowheels and the rest will read this exchange and Im sure we will come to a decision soon. My warmest regards. bobby47
  • Score: 0

10:58pm Fri 9 Nov 12

bobby47 says...

I'll end the days labours by simply saying this, we are all kidding ourselves if we think that we can keep this momentum up without doing some other thing.
The problem is we have to make a move and untill we do and its a collective thing then we aint really going anywhere.
We have to do something thats different. We either get one of our number to contact a Councillor and then sit back and see where fate takes us or we all agree to break cover, meet and take things from there.
What we are doing now is great, it really is some achievement and we should be pleased with ourselves but, as things stand at the moment, we aint really going to progress this momentum.
For my part, I feel like I know everyone and I dont feel the need to know a face behind the Poster and become your bestest Saturday night drinking buddy. Friends I got. I dont want anymore friends. For me, this is business and getting rid of this Council.
We either carry on as we are and I aint got a problem with that or we change our course and do something different.
Discuss!!!!
I'll end the days labours by simply saying this, we are all kidding ourselves if we think that we can keep this momentum up without doing some other thing. The problem is we have to make a move and untill we do and its a collective thing then we aint really going anywhere. We have to do something thats different. We either get one of our number to contact a Councillor and then sit back and see where fate takes us or we all agree to break cover, meet and take things from there. What we are doing now is great, it really is some achievement and we should be pleased with ourselves but, as things stand at the moment, we aint really going to progress this momentum. For my part, I feel like I know everyone and I dont feel the need to know a face behind the Poster and become your bestest Saturday night drinking buddy. Friends I got. I dont want anymore friends. For me, this is business and getting rid of this Council. We either carry on as we are and I aint got a problem with that or we change our course and do something different. Discuss!!!! bobby47
  • Score: 0

9:58am Sat 10 Nov 12

littlewhitebull says...

Twowheelsgood. The actual figure for the "design, host and management of website of hereyoucan.co.uk" was £21,821.35. That figure will come into the public domain shortly. Bear with me for not revealing more, but someone is doing some hard research and I don't want to cause them problems!
A London company was commissioned to "design" the signs on our county's borders - cost = £15,020.06.
"Research" into "development of a brand" = £12,000.
These figures are facts. More information to come in near future!!!!
Hope I haven't spoiled your well-earned weekends.
Twowheelsgood. The actual figure for the "design, host and management of website of hereyoucan.co.uk" was £21,821.35. That figure will come into the public domain shortly. Bear with me for not revealing more, but someone is doing some hard research and I don't want to cause them problems! A London company was commissioned to "design" the signs on our county's borders - cost = £15,020.06. "Research" into "development of a brand" = £12,000. These figures are facts. More information to come in near future!!!! Hope I haven't spoiled your well-earned weekends. littlewhitebull
  • Score: 0

10:16am Sat 10 Nov 12

megilleland says...

littlewhitebull wrote:
I was talking to a group of senior citizens in our city today. They expressed some very strong feelings about the direction the council is taking. To say they were not happy bunnies would be an understatement. All of these senior citizens stressed that they thought our council was wasteful and would like to see a change of direction as soon as possible.
By the way - I came across a website today called www.hereyoucan.co.uk
Do have a look, if you have not seen it before. Our council has spent almost £22,000 on its design and management!
At a time when they are "cash-strapped" and borrowing millions, they can somehow afford the money to fund another self-serving device.
"In an attempt to boost tourism, councillors are considering re-branding the town Funbridge Wells. Other slogans up for discussion include ‘Why not Tunbridge Wells?’ and ‘Cultural Capital of West Kent’."

HC are not the only ones thinking of burning tax payers money on rebranding!

http://www.dailymail

.co.uk/news/article-

2230817/Welcome-Funb

ridge-Wells-Council-

wants-brand-Kent-tow

n-attract-tourists.h

tml
[quote][p][bold]littlewhitebull[/bold] wrote: I was talking to a group of senior citizens in our city today. They expressed some very strong feelings about the direction the council is taking. To say they were not happy bunnies would be an understatement. All of these senior citizens stressed that they thought our council was wasteful and would like to see a change of direction as soon as possible. By the way - I came across a website today called www.hereyoucan.co.uk Do have a look, if you have not seen it before. Our council has spent almost £22,000 on its design and management! At a time when they are "cash-strapped" and borrowing millions, they can somehow afford the money to fund another self-serving device.[/p][/quote]"In an attempt to boost tourism, councillors are considering re-branding the town Funbridge Wells. Other slogans up for discussion include ‘Why not Tunbridge Wells?’ and ‘Cultural Capital of West Kent’." HC are not the only ones thinking of burning tax payers money on rebranding! http://www.dailymail .co.uk/news/article- 2230817/Welcome-Funb ridge-Wells-Council- wants-brand-Kent-tow n-attract-tourists.h tml megilleland
  • Score: 0

12:58pm Sat 10 Nov 12

littlewhitebull says...

Re-branding is a costly business that is going on all over the UK, even in times of severe economic strain and council cutbacks.
Possibly, one of the most bizarre examples was in Bristol. The city had an excellent industrial museum called the ‘M Shed’. The museum needed a great deal of work, so the council spent millions overhauling and upgrading the building. But, they felt the name of ‘M Shed’ was a bit naff, and employed an outside agency to come up with a new name.
This company spent months (apparently) toying with ideas for a flash new name for the museum. Eventually, after receiving their fee of £100,000, the company told Bristol Council that they could not come up with a better name than the original ‘M Shed’.
I am definitely going to apply for a job with the “True North” advertising company.
Re-branding is a costly business that is going on all over the UK, even in times of severe economic strain and council cutbacks. Possibly, one of the most bizarre examples was in Bristol. The city had an excellent industrial museum called the ‘M Shed’. The museum needed a great deal of work, so the council spent millions overhauling and upgrading the building. But, they felt the name of ‘M Shed’ was a bit naff, and employed an outside agency to come up with a new name. This company spent months (apparently) toying with ideas for a flash new name for the museum. Eventually, after receiving their fee of £100,000, the company told Bristol Council that they could not come up with a better name than the original ‘M Shed’. I am definitely going to apply for a job with the “True North” advertising company. littlewhitebull
  • Score: 0

1:11pm Sat 10 Nov 12

Biomech says...

Branding isn't cheap, and a lot of thought can go into coming up with a name - it can involve a lot of work for what seems like one word.

However,I'd like to see the cost break down for that websites £22,000. I do work as a web developer and that is potentially £18-20,000 more than I would have charged for what it is.

Maybe I need to raise my pricing!
Branding isn't cheap, and a lot of thought can go into coming up with a name - it can involve a lot of work for what seems like one word. However,I'd like to see the cost break down for that websites £22,000. I do work as a web developer and that is potentially £18-20,000 more than I would have charged for what it is. Maybe I need to raise my pricing! Biomech
  • Score: 0

2:14pm Sat 10 Nov 12

littlewhitebull says...

Biomech, I appreciate your superior knowledge of website design. Unfortunately, I don't have a breakdown of the whole costing regime, just the information from a Freedom of Information request that HC responded to with the exact words:

"The total cost to design, host and manage the interactive website is £21,821.25."

Good luck with your work, and perhaps HC could place the work locally with people like you?
I am sure 'You Can' do the work better for a fraction of the cost.
Biomech, I appreciate your superior knowledge of website design. Unfortunately, I don't have a breakdown of the whole costing regime, just the information from a Freedom of Information request that HC responded to with the exact words: "The total cost to design, host and manage the interactive website is £21,821.25." Good luck with your work, and perhaps HC could place the work locally with people like you? I am sure 'You Can' do the work better for a fraction of the cost. littlewhitebull
  • Score: 0

2:31pm Sat 10 Nov 12

Biomech says...

lol :) Thank you. Hey, even if I charged them £15,000 they would still be saving :P

Unfortunately, as I've mentioned in other articles, I get the bulk of my work from outside of Hereford - because, quite frankly, Hereford is useless :) The only reason I still live here isdue to logistics, it's balanced between the M5, M4, A40 and A49 which makes it great for getting to my clients :P
lol :) Thank you. Hey, even if I charged them £15,000 they would still be saving :P Unfortunately, as I've mentioned in other articles, I get the bulk of my work from outside of Hereford - because, quite frankly, Hereford is useless :) The only reason I still live here isdue to logistics, it's balanced between the M5, M4, A40 and A49 which makes it great for getting to my clients :P Biomech
  • Score: 0

3:59pm Sat 10 Nov 12

William Rudd says...

The Moderators of the HT do read these Postings and I know for a 'fact' that our views within the HT are noted.

Yeah all five of you lol.
Its going ahead,it will be built..Nuf said
The Moderators of the HT do read these Postings and I know for a 'fact' that our views within the HT are noted. Yeah all five of you lol. Its going ahead,it will be built..Nuf said William Rudd
  • Score: 0

4:09pm Sat 10 Nov 12

Biomech says...

Its not the development that people are objecting too
Its not the development that people are objecting too Biomech
  • Score: 0

4:30pm Sat 10 Nov 12

Lukio says...

As Biomech says, anyone who doesn't want regeneration in Hereford must be mental. The city needs something.

This is bigger than regeneration now. Yes, HC have seemingly ballsed it up monumentally and it's now become a vanity project but it's not just regeneration they're failing on. It's a massively long list. If people can't see it then they're blind.

And to prove William wrong, as I'm pretty sure he is, can we get a nod of concurrence from the HT that they do read these comments? It would be good for King Bobby ;)
As Biomech says, anyone who doesn't want regeneration in Hereford must be mental. The city needs something. This is bigger than regeneration now. Yes, HC have seemingly ballsed it up monumentally and it's now become a vanity project but it's not just regeneration they're failing on. It's a massively long list. If people can't see it then they're blind. And to prove William wrong, as I'm pretty sure he is, can we get a nod of concurrence from the HT that they do read these comments? It would be good for King Bobby ;) Lukio
  • Score: 0

4:55pm Sat 10 Nov 12

bobby47 says...

Hello William. Im glad you are back.
My best regards.
Hello William. Im glad you are back. My best regards. bobby47
  • Score: 0

5:05pm Sat 10 Nov 12

TwoWheelsGood says...

littlewhitebull - that FOI response is interesting - it only refers to the website. I suspect there is a much larger fee for the branding per se - I just don't see a large London design studio even getting out of bed for £22k.
littlewhitebull - that FOI response is interesting - it only refers to the website. I suspect there is a much larger fee for the branding per se - I just don't see a large London design studio even getting out of bed for £22k. TwoWheelsGood
  • Score: 0

3:30pm Sun 11 Nov 12

littlewhitebull says...

Biomech wrote:
lol :) Thank you. Hey, even if I charged them £15,000 they would still be saving :P

Unfortunately, as I've mentioned in other articles, I get the bulk of my work from outside of Hereford - because, quite frankly, Hereford is useless :) The only reason I still live here isdue to logistics, it's balanced between the M5, M4, A40 and A49 which makes it great for getting to my clients :P
It's a pity our council does not use the skills of the people already living here - like yourself, Biomech.
As you are in the business of web development, what did you actually think of the HC website - hereyoucan?
If you compare it with say - www.investindevon.co
.uk - it seems to me that Devon offers some very useful contacts and help that would be very useful to businesses. i.e. a lot of relevant info. Perhaps, this is a rather unfair comparison as hereyoucan is a different concept?
Good to hear your views on this Biomech.
[quote][p][bold]Biomech[/bold] wrote: lol :) Thank you. Hey, even if I charged them £15,000 they would still be saving :P Unfortunately, as I've mentioned in other articles, I get the bulk of my work from outside of Hereford - because, quite frankly, Hereford is useless :) The only reason I still live here isdue to logistics, it's balanced between the M5, M4, A40 and A49 which makes it great for getting to my clients :P[/p][/quote]It's a pity our council does not use the skills of the people already living here - like yourself, Biomech. As you are in the business of web development, what did you actually think of the HC website - hereyoucan? If you compare it with say - www.investindevon.co .uk - it seems to me that Devon offers some very useful contacts and help that would be very useful to businesses. i.e. a lot of relevant info. Perhaps, this is a rather unfair comparison as hereyoucan is a different concept? Good to hear your views on this Biomech. littlewhitebull
  • Score: 0

4:04pm Sun 11 Nov 12

Biomech says...

The hereyoucan website doesn't really seem to have a point. I had to scroll through 5 slides until I actually found what the site is there for. Even then, there isn't a great deal on the website itself. You have to spend some considerable time on it to work out what's going on. Essentially it's just a merchandising guide for partners and stakeholders. ie, here's a list of usuable logos, this is how they are aligned to maintain conformity.

This kind of thing is something you see in private company intranets. At most, it would have sufficed as a page or two on a main, already established website.

The design isn't great, but I'm sure you can see that. It's like a small scribble on a big white page. The quotes page is a good example, there's a lot of wasted space - which makes the page appear unnecessary.

They make a big deal about photography being huge in the brand. The photography in the PDF isn't that great and has some harsh chromatic Aberration (purple/green fringing). More over, however, they state they have set up a flickr group to act as a community for photos/sharers in Hereford, yet provide no link. Instead you have to email them for more information.

The code isn't efficient either. I mean look at what you have. 1 carousel that you can get the code for free ANYWHERE on the net. Under that, a poor page of quotes, a list of contacts and a paragraph about photos. Then a PDF link that they probably didn't make themselves. There is actually nothing there for anyone but insider businesses (registration required might I add)

Devon - I haven't plowed through, but at a quick glance, it's thinner than I would have it, but it looks packed with information. It tells you right there on the homepage what the site is for and provides great navigation and structure to the sections making it easier to find what you want.

But you are right, the Devon site is a public fronted sales pitch. The Hereford site is basically an internal guide on how to use the here you can logos.
The hereyoucan website doesn't really seem to have a point. I had to scroll through 5 slides until I actually found what the site is there for. Even then, there isn't a great deal on the website itself. You have to spend some considerable time on it to work out what's going on. Essentially it's just a merchandising guide for partners and stakeholders. ie, here's a list of usuable logos, this is how they are aligned to maintain conformity. This kind of thing is something you see in private company intranets. At most, it would have sufficed as a page or two on a main, already established website. The design isn't great, but I'm sure you can see that. It's like a small scribble on a big white page. The quotes page is a good example, there's a lot of wasted space - which makes the page appear unnecessary. They make a big deal about photography being huge in the brand. The photography in the PDF isn't that great and has some harsh chromatic Aberration (purple/green fringing). More over, however, they state they have set up a flickr group to act as a community for photos/sharers in Hereford, yet provide no link. Instead you have to email them for more information. The code isn't efficient either. I mean look at what you have. 1 carousel that you can get the code for free ANYWHERE on the net. Under that, a poor page of quotes, a list of contacts and a paragraph about photos. Then a PDF link that they probably didn't make themselves. There is actually nothing there for anyone but insider businesses (registration required might I add) Devon - I haven't plowed through, but at a quick glance, it's thinner than I would have it, but it looks packed with information. It tells you right there on the homepage what the site is for and provides great navigation and structure to the sections making it easier to find what you want. But you are right, the Devon site is a public fronted sales pitch. The Hereford site is basically an internal guide on how to use the here you can logos. Biomech
  • Score: 0

4:08pm Sun 11 Nov 12

Biomech says...

Just to add. There's nothing wrong with having a whole website dedicated to the branding of HereYouCan... it's just that it doesn't require £22,000
Just to add. There's nothing wrong with having a whole website dedicated to the branding of HereYouCan... it's just that it doesn't require £22,000 Biomech
  • Score: 0

5:01pm Sun 11 Nov 12

littlewhitebull says...

Thanks, Biomech. Very interesting to have an opinion from a person in the 'know'. I don't disagree with anything you say. Many thanks. Good luck with your business.
Thanks, Biomech. Very interesting to have an opinion from a person in the 'know'. I don't disagree with anything you say. Many thanks. Good luck with your business. littlewhitebull
  • Score: 0

5:21pm Sun 11 Nov 12

Lukio says...

Guys, I may have picked up on a chance to change the regime. This is not my suggestion but something I was thinking about and reading an article on a social media site confirms the theory.

Basically, in the up coming Police and Crime Commissioner (PCC) elections we need to vote for, and it pains me to say, Adrian Blackshaw. He is the Tory councillor for Wormsley Ridge.

Although this goes against all my beliefs, it may pave the way for change. If he is successful, it will lead to a by-election in the Wormsley Ridge ward. IF an opposition party wins the seat, we'll have a hung council as the Tories won't have majority any more.

I don't know how you feel about this and I'd NEVER vote Tory in anything but this may be the chance we need.

Spread the word, change is upon us.
Guys, I may have picked up on a chance to change the regime. This is not my suggestion but something I was thinking about and reading an article on a social media site confirms the theory. Basically, in the up coming Police and Crime Commissioner (PCC) elections we need to vote for, and it pains me to say, Adrian Blackshaw. He is the Tory councillor for Wormsley Ridge. Although this goes against all my beliefs, it may pave the way for change. If he is successful, it will lead to a by-election in the Wormsley Ridge ward. IF an opposition party wins the seat, we'll have a hung council as the Tories won't have majority any more. I don't know how you feel about this and I'd NEVER vote Tory in anything but this may be the chance we need. Spread the word, change is upon us. Lukio
  • Score: 0

5:39pm Sun 11 Nov 12

Biomech says...

littlewhitebull wrote:
Thanks, Biomech. Very interesting to have an opinion from a person in the 'know'. I don't disagree with anything you say. Many thanks. Good luck with your business.
Thanks :)
[quote][p][bold]littlewhitebull[/bold] wrote: Thanks, Biomech. Very interesting to have an opinion from a person in the 'know'. I don't disagree with anything you say. Many thanks. Good luck with your business.[/p][/quote]Thanks :) Biomech
  • Score: 0

6:52pm Sun 11 Nov 12

Wellymitts says...

Spreading the word Lukio....
Spreading the word Lukio.... Wellymitts
  • Score: 0

7:33pm Sun 11 Nov 12

bobby47 says...

Lukio, I cant do it kiddo. Never! I'd rather give up me crown.
Lukio, I cant do it kiddo. Never! I'd rather give up me crown. bobby47
  • Score: 0

7:42pm Sun 11 Nov 12

Lukio says...

But Bobby, come on, this is for the greater good! We have a chance to change things here...we can get rid of slimy Blackshaw and be in with a chance of swinging the balance of the power in the council!

It makes sense Bobby! I know you can do it!
But Bobby, come on, this is for the greater good! We have a chance to change things here...we can get rid of slimy Blackshaw and be in with a chance of swinging the balance of the power in the council! It makes sense Bobby! I know you can do it! Lukio
  • Score: 0

8:01pm Sun 11 Nov 12

Biomech says...

I like how they tell us that voting on the PCC is democracy in action.

Yeah, about as democratic as telling you you are going to have a terminal disease but you have a choice, cancer or tumour. Hey, you can't complain, you get to choose!
I like how they tell us that voting on the PCC is democracy in action. Yeah, about as democratic as telling you you are going to have a terminal disease but you have a choice, cancer or tumour. Hey, you can't complain, you get to choose! Biomech
  • Score: 0

8:11pm Sun 11 Nov 12

bobby47 says...

Dear good friend. Never! I just cant. You do it if you wish. I wont think any the less of you but I cant do it.
Dear good friend. Never! I just cant. You do it if you wish. I wont think any the less of you but I cant do it. bobby47
  • Score: 0

9:29pm Sun 11 Nov 12

dippyhippy says...

Do we know if the last election result in Wormsley Ridge was a close run thing,or did the tories win by a mile? In other words,does a candidate fielded by another party have a hope in hell? I can see Lukios reasoning,and if I thought my vote could help secure change,then with very heavy heart,I think I would....but only if I thought there was a realistic chance.My grandad will be turning in his grave!
Do we know if the last election result in Wormsley Ridge was a close run thing,or did the tories win by a mile? In other words,does a candidate fielded by another party have a hope in hell? I can see Lukios reasoning,and if I thought my vote could help secure change,then with very heavy heart,I think I would....but only if I thought there was a realistic chance.My grandad will be turning in his grave! dippyhippy
  • Score: 0

9:29pm Sun 11 Nov 12

dippyhippy says...

Do we know if the last election result in Wormsley Ridge was a close run thing,or did the tories win by a mile? In other words,does a candidate fielded by another party have a hope in hell? I can see Lukios reasoning,and if I thought my vote could help secure change,then with very heavy heart,I think I would....but only if I thought there was a realistic chance.My grandad will be turning in his grave!
Do we know if the last election result in Wormsley Ridge was a close run thing,or did the tories win by a mile? In other words,does a candidate fielded by another party have a hope in hell? I can see Lukios reasoning,and if I thought my vote could help secure change,then with very heavy heart,I think I would....but only if I thought there was a realistic chance.My grandad will be turning in his grave! dippyhippy
  • Score: 0

10:13pm Sun 11 Nov 12

bobby47 says...

I think Ive read this right. Blackshaw got 603 votes. Second was an Independent with 385 votes.
I think Ive read this right. Blackshaw got 603 votes. Second was an Independent with 385 votes. bobby47
  • Score: 0

5:35pm Mon 12 Nov 12

TwoWheelsGood says...

I believe the PCC role can be 'part time' which means Blackadder may hang on to both roles, so Lukio's idea, which is also being kicked around on WIHAHC and IOC pages, may not be watertight.
I believe the PCC role can be 'part time' which means Blackadder may hang on to both roles, so Lukio's idea, which is also being kicked around on WIHAHC and IOC pages, may not be watertight. TwoWheelsGood
  • Score: 0

6:32pm Mon 12 Nov 12

bobby47 says...

Oh! It's so bloody depressing. I spit on them all. A curse on all of them.
Never a break. Never a single boost.
Oh! It's so bloody depressing. I spit on them all. A curse on all of them. Never a break. Never a single boost. bobby47
  • Score: 0

11:25pm Mon 12 Nov 12

megilleland says...

Ross on Wye West Result
5th May 2011

BARTRUM, CHRISTOPHER MARK 617 (Elected)
Liberal Democrats
LUCAS, GORDON 597 (Elected)
Local Conservatives
TEAGUE, MARILYN ANN 522
Independent
SINCLAIR POWELL, MARY ANN 503
Independent
GIBBS, NIGEL THOMAS 383
Local Conservatives
HUGHES, PATRICK 368
Liberal Democrats
BROWN, MARGARET DOROTHY BARNARD 97
It's OUR County (Herefordshire)
Ross on Wye West Result 5th May 2011 BARTRUM, CHRISTOPHER MARK 617 (Elected) Liberal Democrats LUCAS, GORDON 597 (Elected) Local Conservatives TEAGUE, MARILYN ANN 522 Independent SINCLAIR POWELL, MARY ANN 503 Independent GIBBS, NIGEL THOMAS 383 Local Conservatives HUGHES, PATRICK 368 Liberal Democrats BROWN, MARGARET DOROTHY BARNARD 97 It's OUR County (Herefordshire) megilleland
  • Score: 0

11:28pm Mon 12 Nov 12

megilleland says...

Wormsley Ridge West Result
5th May 2011

BLACKSHAW, ADRIAN JAMES MICHAEL 603 (Elected)
(Known as Adrian Blackshaw)
Local Conservatives
JONES, MICHAEL JOHN 385
(Known as Mike Jones)
Independent
DU HEAUME, MARY KYRLE 120
(Known as Kyrle du Heaume)
Green Party
Wormsley Ridge West Result 5th May 2011 BLACKSHAW, ADRIAN JAMES MICHAEL 603 (Elected) (Known as Adrian Blackshaw) Local Conservatives JONES, MICHAEL JOHN 385 (Known as Mike Jones) Independent DU HEAUME, MARY KYRLE 120 (Known as Kyrle du Heaume) Green Party megilleland
  • Score: 0

11:35pm Mon 12 Nov 12

megilleland says...

I have put the Ross on Wye West vote on the board as it is reported Gordon Lucas died over the weekend. This makes it another seat the Conservatives could lose.
I have put the Ross on Wye West vote on the board as it is reported Gordon Lucas died over the weekend. This makes it another seat the Conservatives could lose. megilleland
  • Score: 0

10:58am Thu 15 Nov 12

apdor says...

I think we need to be slightly careful in believing everything the Hereford Times Reports. The Bias is incredible at times especially when the council is involved.

News papers should report a balanced view rather than the sensational unbalance which sells papers !

In terms of the revenue the New ESG will bring into the county 1/2 a million is basically nothing.

As for the 'Here You Can Brand' the site is for businesses to access the resources so they can promote their brands and help promote the city ! I agree that the £20000 is over the top for a simple web design, but if this figure also includes all the logo designs etc used then I think this would be acceptable.

Roads - The A and B Roads are better than they were 5 years ago (if you really think about it !)

Unfortunately the Labour government spent all our money, now the Local Councils are having to tighten there belts and make cuts. The council is amongst these cuts trying to grow the city and give it some potential so that it doesnt become a glorified Old peoples home.

I don't proclaim they are doing everything right, there is much that can be improved! but the shops in High town which have gone bust is nothing to do with the council. A recession sorts out the businesses that are badly managed and scrape buy in the Good years. most businesses I know are growing this year! Those that are not are doing something wrong. !

The problem is the other parties as with all politics shout and ball about the opposition but actually have no meat around the ideas they have to do better!
I think we need to be slightly careful in believing everything the Hereford Times Reports. The Bias is incredible at times especially when the council is involved. News papers should report a balanced view rather than the sensational unbalance which sells papers ! In terms of the revenue the New ESG will bring into the county 1/2 a million is basically nothing. As for the 'Here You Can Brand' the site is for businesses to access the resources so they can promote their brands and help promote the city ! I agree that the £20000 is over the top for a simple web design, but if this figure also includes all the logo designs etc used then I think this would be acceptable. Roads - The A and B Roads are better than they were 5 years ago (if you really think about it !) Unfortunately the Labour government spent all our money, now the Local Councils are having to tighten there belts and make cuts. The council is amongst these cuts trying to grow the city and give it some potential so that it doesnt become a glorified Old peoples home. I don't proclaim they are doing everything right, there is much that can be improved! but the shops in High town which have gone bust is nothing to do with the council. A recession sorts out the businesses that are badly managed and scrape buy in the Good years. most businesses I know are growing this year! Those that are not are doing something wrong. ! The problem is the other parties as with all politics shout and ball about the opposition but actually have no meat around the ideas they have to do better! apdor
  • Score: 0

11:19am Thu 15 Nov 12

apdor says...

I would like to add, that after a little bit of research and a more accurate picture is this.

The developer was going to pay HC 1.5 Million as a end of build pay off.

Now they are only going to give 1million, This is not money the council have given away.

As normal the Hereford Times have failed to report accurately the news !
I would like to add, that after a little bit of research and a more accurate picture is this. The developer was going to pay HC 1.5 Million as a end of build pay off. Now they are only going to give 1million, This is not money the council have given away. As normal the Hereford Times have failed to report accurately the news ! apdor
  • Score: 0

11:28am Thu 15 Nov 12

TwoWheelsGood says...

Worth repeating, which ever way it is reported or apdor likes to spin it, that there will be £0.5m LESS in the Council's kitty then there would have been had they not caved in to Stanhope's demands. Roads better than they were 5 years ago?! I don't thin so - some bias from apdor surely??
Worth repeating, which ever way it is reported or apdor likes to spin it, that there will be £0.5m LESS in the Council's kitty then there would have been had they not caved in to Stanhope's demands. Roads better than they were 5 years ago?! I don't thin so - some bias from apdor surely?? TwoWheelsGood
  • Score: 0

11:37am Thu 15 Nov 12

Wellymitts says...

I would love to be driving on the roads that aren't that bad Apdor!!! Could you tell me where they are please and I will change my routes!!!!
I would love to be driving on the roads that aren't that bad Apdor!!! Could you tell me where they are please and I will change my routes!!!! Wellymitts
  • Score: 0

11:42am Thu 15 Nov 12

apdor says...

Two Wheels - yet its still an extra 1m in the kitty which is a benefit. Not sure many businesses would give the council a pay out at the end of building a premise.


What bias would i have ? I run my own business, and offered my opinion. Which every one is entailed to do !

Wellymitts - I didnt say they were not bad ... i said that compared to 5 years ago they are better.
Two Wheels - yet its still an extra 1m in the kitty which is a benefit. Not sure many businesses would give the council a pay out at the end of building a premise. What bias would i have ? I run my own business, and offered my opinion. Which every one is entailed to do ! Wellymitts - I didnt say they were not bad ... i said that compared to 5 years ago they are better. apdor
  • Score: 0

2:36pm Thu 15 Nov 12

dippyhippy says...

I know nobody likes cuts,but savings have to be made.People get that.What they don't get is the councils warped sense of priorities when it comes to spending our cash! I realise that some funds are ring-fenced,and cannot be transferred to other services,but at times of belts being ever tightened,I do not feel that the council are making best use of the resources available.Just my opinion!!
I know nobody likes cuts,but savings have to be made.People get that.What they don't get is the councils warped sense of priorities when it comes to spending our cash! I realise that some funds are ring-fenced,and cannot be transferred to other services,but at times of belts being ever tightened,I do not feel that the council are making best use of the resources available.Just my opinion!! dippyhippy
  • Score: 0

10:19am Fri 16 Nov 12

megilleland says...

I don't proclaim they are doing everything right, there is much that can be improved! but the shops in High town which have gone bust is nothing to do with the council. A recession sorts out the businesses that are badly managed and scrape buy in the Good years. most businesses I know are growing this year! Those that are not are doing something wrong


Walking through Maylords yesterday and notice that Jessops is closing at the end of the month, must be doing something wrong!
[quote]I don't proclaim they are doing everything right, there is much that can be improved! but the shops in High town which have gone bust is nothing to do with the council. A recession sorts out the businesses that are badly managed and scrape buy in the Good years. most businesses I know are growing this year! Those that are not are doing something wrong[/quote] Walking through Maylords yesterday and notice that Jessops is closing at the end of the month, must be doing something wrong! megilleland
  • Score: 0

10:28am Fri 16 Nov 12

megilleland says...

More interesting payments in the Council contracts 2012 that £266,000 was paid to The Showman's Guild last May in connection with the fair in Hereford and that £42,000 was paid to Henry Morris in connection with the fair in Leominster. No wonder they come here every year!
More interesting payments in the Council contracts 2012 that £266,000 was paid to The Showman's Guild last May in connection with the fair in Hereford and that £42,000 was paid to Henry Morris in connection with the fair in Leominster. No wonder they come here every year! megilleland
  • Score: 0

12:19pm Fri 16 Nov 12

Biomech says...

I must agree, driving around the country weekly, the only time I notice a significant drop in road quality is in small country lanes and Hereford. In fact, I distinctly remember driving about 30 miles around the Yorkshire Dales and noticing how perfectly smooth and kept the road was, even if on the narrow side :P

I'm sure the HT do spin some stories to make headlines, but you only need to stick your head out of the window to see that Hereford has failed.

Also, in the interest of public service, it's 12.20 lunch time Friday and I've just been told Whitecross Road is gridlocked again, so I'd avoid that route if you can.
I must agree, driving around the country weekly, the only time I notice a significant drop in road quality is in small country lanes and Hereford. In fact, I distinctly remember driving about 30 miles around the Yorkshire Dales and noticing how perfectly smooth and kept the road was, even if on the narrow side :P I'm sure the HT do spin some stories to make headlines, but you only need to stick your head out of the window to see that Hereford has failed. Also, in the interest of public service, it's 12.20 lunch time Friday and I've just been told Whitecross Road is gridlocked again, so I'd avoid that route if you can. Biomech
  • Score: 0

12:46pm Fri 16 Nov 12

bobby47 says...

Bloody Hell! Why on earth are we paying three hundred k to a couple of firms to entertain us for a few days each year.
It's crazy and deluded thinking. The only way this could be justified is if they secured a wire from the Black and White House to Lloyds Bank and they dressed Jarvis in some brightly decorated caped costume and forced him up the ladder and be made to walk the wire without a safety net.
What are this Council thinking!
It's like the running of Rome. Put on some gladiator games and entertain the masses and let them forget their bloody misery for a long weekend.
We are bloody doomed.
Bloody Hell! Why on earth are we paying three hundred k to a couple of firms to entertain us for a few days each year. It's crazy and deluded thinking. The only way this could be justified is if they secured a wire from the Black and White House to Lloyds Bank and they dressed Jarvis in some brightly decorated caped costume and forced him up the ladder and be made to walk the wire without a safety net. What are this Council thinking! It's like the running of Rome. Put on some gladiator games and entertain the masses and let them forget their bloody misery for a long weekend. We are bloody doomed. bobby47
  • Score: 0

8:28pm Fri 16 Nov 12

megilleland says...

I was surprised that the sums seemed unusual. Maybe it was for removing a number of bollards to make way for the rides. Maybe a councillor can elucidate?
I was surprised that the sums seemed unusual. Maybe it was for removing a number of bollards to make way for the rides. Maybe a councillor can elucidate? megilleland
  • Score: 0

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